FFB Mods - F1 2010 Lacks Definition and Feel

[Derek Speare]

Hi all,

I go back and forth upon my moods to F1 2010. I think it's great, but leaves me wishing for more...like more feel. Sims like GTR2, Evo and rFactor have extensive FFB definition, and if you know what you're doing, you can get your FFB wheel to give you quite a bit of feel. Unfortunately, this is something missing in F1 2010.

Has anyone found anything that relates to tweaking the FFB so we can get braking and loss of grip feelings thru the FFB? If you have, please post it up.

Any help is most appreciated.

d

[Cartoondriver]

I'm looking for the same thing, I was recently given a copy of GT Legends and after feeling the FFB in that game it has almost ruined F1 2010 for me.
My wheel is a Logitech Driving Force EX which is sold as a PS wheel, it works on the PC with the Logitech drivers but isn't a 'supported wheel' in game.

Out of frustration I have started playing around with some of the settings in the
devicesetup.xml file (ForceFeedback folder) and I adjusted the default settings to the following

<FFBDevice name="default" scaleForce="1.0" scaleFriction="0.8" baseFriction="-5.0" maxFriction="35.0" scaleEffects="1.0" delay="0.0"/>
i.e. same as the Logitech MoMo. As fas as a result, well it is different but I can't say I am happy with it.

There seems to be a huge disparity in what people are getting from FFB, some are happy while others are getting none. I heard the patch killed FFB for some people so I'm curious as to what they changed. I would like to try a V1 of the game to see if my wheel worked better with that but as I got it from Steam I'm sort of stuck.

What wheel are you using?

[slashthetexan]

Maybe because it's a console game made for people using gamepads who may or may not have "rumble" in their pad.
Why put FFB into a game when you make it for console players who don't care about FFB?

[adriecoot]

slash is right, this is a straight up console port. it doesnt even support the mouse.

i gave up on the title and uninstalled it, the next version i will get for the PS3 and use it as what its meant to be.. a very realistic arcade game.

in my opinion there's no point in trying to make this feel like a hardcore simulator. go with iracing or FVA if you want to drive an F1 computer simulator. or play with f1 2010 as a video game.

[at0mikab00m]

Hey, I'm currently looking into editing effectsetup.xml but I could use some pointers if anyone has experience with this file?

I'm using a logitech drivefx which was originally designed for xbox but works just as great for PC. It gets detected as a generic xbox 360 wheel which is fine. The force feedback feels great but only if I turn the enviroment FB to 0 or 10%. Any higher and the rumble interferes with the force feedback.

I'd like to retain or improve some of the rumble/feedback for wheel lock, curbs, and gear shifting so that I can set environment rumble to 50%+ without having the rumble ruin the feel of the feedback.

Can anyone help with editing effectsetup.xml?

[at0mikab00m]

HELL YES!
I've been messing with this file for about an hour or so and I finally came across this thread on a GRID forum. It tells how to enhance effectsetup.xml to provide more responsive feedback. I'm going to try this out and I'll post back with the results.

Originally Posted by http://community.codemasters.com/forum/grid-pc-modifications-1022/288964-few-effectsetup-file-tweaks.html

a few effectsetup file tweaks
hey how ya doin?
if you're like me and you like having enough force feedback effects to make it seem like the car is actually on a paved road as opposed to a frozen lake you may wanna try some of these tweaks...back-up your effectsetup xml located in the forcefeedback folder first and fire away

look for this line towards the bottom of the file and change to these values

<FFBSample name="tarmac" wave="192836452623" envelope="1306703041265493" rubmlerScale="1.1" wheelScale="0.6"/>
higher values means more effects although I would'nt advise going way over the stock values as it might be hard on the rumblers

if you would like more effect under "surface vibrations" find this line and change the FFBSurface scale to this
<FFBSurface scale="0.21" name="TARMAC" grip="1.0" thresholdLow="5.0" thresholdHigh="10.0" freqLow="26.0" freqHigh="52.0" scaleLow="0.0" scaleHigh="1.0" length="0.1" sample="tarmac"/>

if you would like to feel the transmission throb change to these values

<FFBSample name="gearChange" wave="1111199999" envelope="9876543210" channel="1" rubmlerScale="1.3" wheelScale="0.6"/>
<FFBSample name="gearChange2" wave="1111199999" envelope="9876543210" channel="1" rubmlerScale="1.3" wheelScale="0.6"/>
<FFBSample name="gearChange3" wave="1111199999" envelope="9876543210" channel="1" rubmlerScale="1.3" wheelScale="0.6"/>
<FFBSample name="gearChange4" wave="1111199999" envelope="9876543210" channel="1" rubmlerScale="1.3" wheelScale="0.6"/>

and while I not 100% sure I'm hoping that these changes have brought up abit more front tire "scrub" effects

<FFBSample name="skidVibration1" wave="955555555555555" envelope="9" wheelScale="0.3"/>
<FFBSample name="skidVibration2" wave="955555555555555" envelope="9" channel="1" wheelScale="0.3"/>

you'll probably have to change the force feedback settings ingame afterwards..I've found that I get the "cleanest" effects by keeping the weight up high and the other 2 much lower....even before I changed anything in this file I found that if force strengh was any higher than 10% the effects were chunky as hell and felt awful....however I dig what I got now.
see ya later

[adriecoot]

i'd be interested in trying your settings if you find them positive enough.

report back with your results, and thanks for sharing!

[Cartoondriver]

Very interested in hearing how you get on with this.

[at0mikab00m]

Alright, I've spent the day messing around with various mods on this game and I've learned quite a bit. Among other things, I've got my wheel setup perfectly tuned for my liking.

Here's some info concerning effectsetup.xml,

Originally Posted by effectsetup.xml

<!-- Effect setup for force feedback
This file holds the list and parameters for all force feedback effects.
Effects are: steering forces, collisions, surfaces etc. Each of them has a different set of parameters.-->

So each section is broken up with mediocre commenting to explain the parameters. I'm going to try to explain them here (bear with me). First, I should mention that the feedback 'messages' are referred to as 'samples'.


The main sections are:
- FFBCollision - contains profiles for collision (small, med, big)
ex: <FFBCollision scale="1.3" thresholdLow="0.1" thresholdHigh="4.0" damageZone="0" freq="10.0" length="0.25" sample="smallCollision"/>

- scale = effect strength
- thresholdLow = lower threshold of impulse (not really sure how to explain this)
- thresholdHigh = higher threshold of impulse (again, not sure)
- damageZone = zone of collision (I'm guessing 0 = anywhere on the car)
- freq = how fast (in hz.) to play the sample/rumble
- length = length of sample (how long to rumble)
- sample = which sample to play

- FFBSurface - contains profiles for driving on various surfaces (tarmac, gravel, water, etc.)
ex: <FFBSurface scale="0.10" name="TARMAC" grip="1.0" thresholdLow="6.0" thresholdHigh="10.0" freqLow="35.0" freqHigh="55.0" scaleLow="0.0" scaleHigh="1.0" length="0.1" sample="tarmac"/>

- scale = effect strength
- name = which surface the effect is for
- grip = multiplier of tyre forces over the surface (1.0 feels very grippy like pavement where 0.1 would feel very slippery like driving over water)
- thresholdLow = lower traveling speed threshold in m/s to scale effect in between (I'm guessing the thershold at which the 'slow' version of the effect plays)
- thresholdHigh = higher traveling speed thershold ... (Threshold for the 'fast' version of the effect)
- freqLow = freq range (speed in Hz) for 'slow' version of effect
- freqHigh = freq range (speed in Hz) for 'fast' version of effect
- scaleLow - envelope scale low (it's supposed to apply an envelope which could be used for fades of the oscillation but I haven't messed with it)
- scaleHigh = envelope scale high (same as above)
- length = length of sample (how long to rumble)
- sample = name of sample to play

- FFBGearChange - contains profiles for changing gear
ex: <FFBGearChange scale="0.50" gear="1" freq="35.0" length="0.20" sample="gearChange"/>

- scale = effect strength
- gear = gear when effect should be played (-1 for all gears)
- freq = how fast to play sample / rumble
- length = sample length
- sample = name of sample to play

- FFBSuspension - contains profiles for 'landing mainly' (I haven't messed around with this yet but the parameters should be self-explanatory at this point)
ex: <FFBSuspension scale="0.25" thresholdLow="0.75" thresholdHigh="2.0" length="0.1" freq="5" sample="suspension0"/>


Lastly, the FFBSample Section
- FFBSample
The FFBSample section contains the "feedback samples" that will get "played" when they are called upon from each FFB section.

Originally Posted by FFBSample Section

<FFBSample name="smallCollision" wave="124689986421" envelope="9812543210"/>
<FFBSample name="mediumCollision" wave="1972356243" envelope="9654321021340"/>
<FFBSample name="bigCollision" wave="1972356243" envelope="9654321021310"/>

- name = name of sample
- wave = waveform of sample, ranges from 1 .. 9 as min and max values (I have no idea how these numbers are generated as they seem to be random but do carry a similar pattern)
- envelope = the envelope applyed while the sample is playing can be used to fade in/out samples (Again, not sure how these numbers are used)
- channel = vibration channel to play sample to (0 = default, 1 = second rumbler motor, do not specify "channel=" for both)
- rubmlerScale = amount to scale output with on a rumbler device (amount of rumble)
- wheelScale = amount to scale output with on a proportional FFB device (not really sure but I think this is for certain types of wheels. my wheel uses rumblerScale to adjust the strength, others have said wheelScale does this for them.)



How it all comes together
Let's look at the FFBCollision for example:

Originally Posted by FFBCollision Section

<FFBCollision scale="1.3" thresholdLow="0.1" thresholdHigh="4.0" damageZone="0" freq="10.0" length="0.25" sample="smallCollision"/>
<FFBCollision scale="2.7" thresholdLow="4.0" thresholdHigh="10.0" damageZone="0" freq="10.0" length="0.3" sample="mediumCollision"/>
<FFBCollision scale="3.3" thresholdLow="10.0" thresholdHigh="100.0" damageZone="0" freq="15.0" length="0.35" sample="bigCollision"/>

These are the three types of collisions that generate force feedback - as you can see, there is an entry for small, medium, and big. Each entry calls upon the appropriate sample defined in the FFBSample section (see above). Should a duplicate entry exist with the same name, the PC will choose at random. In my collision section, I have 4 versions of each crash to provide a variety of responses.


There are also these three definitions that I have not touched but they provide rumble/feedback settings for a damaged car

- FFBWheelDamage
- FFBEffectSteering
- FFBSlipAngle

<!-- Wheel damage effect, played between given levels of damage-->
<FFBWheelDamage scale="1.0" thresholdLow="0.2" thresholdHigh="1.0" scaleLow="0.0" scaleHigh="1.0" sample="wheelDamage"/>
<FFBEffectSteering scale="1.0" frictionThresholdLow="1.5" frictionLow="50" frictionThresholdHigh="50" frictionHigh="30" forceScale="1.0" forceThresholdLow="1.0" forceLow="0.1" forceThresholdHigh="50.0" forceHigh="0.5"/>
<FFBSlipAngle scale="1.0" thresholdLow="1" thresholdHigh="15" min="0.1" peak="1" max="3" minScale="1" peakScale="1" maxScale="0.5" minForce="0" peakForce="1" maxForce="0.6"/>

Also there is a section at the bottom of the FFBSample that contains skidVibration1 and skidVibration2. As these samples use wheelScale, I can not test this out. I tried adding rumblerScale but it had no effect. Not sure really how to make it work for wheels that don't support wheelscale but skid vibrations sound cool.


Hopefully this post does a decent job of explaining things a little bit better than the lax commenting provided by codemasters.

[at0mikab00m]

Forgot to attach this to my last post

[Derek Speare]

Originally Posted by at0mikab00m

Forgot to attach this to my last post

Thanks for your efforts with this!

Derek

[Cartoondriver]

Thanks, it feels much better now with your settings.

Cheers
Andy

[at0mikab00m]

Cheers guys, hope you're enjoying the new settings.

If anyone tweaks this file further and finds out any useful info, please post back.

[Doggie2k]

its much better but Ive still got this sensitivity problem with my DFGT and its driving me up the wall. Its like the force feedback is in reverse (inverted) and I get no feeling from the steering when I'm on a straight line. Theres too much give in the steering which means I have trouble steering around corners.

[at0mikab00m]

Originally Posted by Doggie2k

its much better but Ive still got this sensitivity problem with my DFGT and its driving me up the wall. Its like the force feedback is in reverse (inverted) and I get no feeling from the steering when I'm on a straight line. Theres too much give in the steering which means I have trouble steering around corners.

I noticed before I calibrated my wheel, driving in a straight line would give no force feedback or rumble.

Try going to your control panel, devices and printers, right click your wheel and run the calibration utility. This should help a bit.

Also in the game set:
steering deadzone 0%
steering saturation 100%
steering linearity 50%

enviromental effects 30%
feedback strength 100%
wheel weight 100%

Hopefully this helps a little

[NVIDIAGeek]

How's the FFB of GTR2 & rFactor with MOMO? Are there any good mods for the FFB of these games?

[Uff]

I've just tried this new file with my G27 and I like it: it's true that on straights you get less feedback, but I prefer it this way as I found that default values were really exaggerated.
Curb effect is better too, imho.

[Louike]

Hi at0mikab00m, i've been using your presets for a while now and i only have one request. please tell me how i can get more vibration in the straight line... i really think that would make it prefect.

I had the pleasure to drive a F1 simulator (live for speed) with a moving chair last week and the ffb in a straight line was crazy... (that's the best resemblance i have to reality )

[JellybeanTiger]

Thanks for this file.
I'm using it with F1 2011 and it works nicely.