Originally Posted by jackolson
To be specific, the GTR Evo garage setup is very limiting for me. That is why I go to the hdc and eng files to "broaden" the parameters, say increase the options for available tire air pressure settings.
In my opinion, this (garage not being enough) depends on one's perspective and objectives.
Putting aside the professional side of things and just focusing on the simracer side of it, if one looks for changes similar to those team mechanics and engineers effect on cars during a race (all setup related changes), then the garage from any isiMOTOR2 sim is adequate.
If you want to change suspension and tire behaviour, garage settings will not help you.
It doesn't help me when I'm in the process of defining the whole behaviour of a car. Afterwards, during a race or qualy, garage settings have their value.
I use the tyr files just to adjust the roll resistance of the given models, in my view, is like changing the thread patterns of the tires. I maybe totally wrong in doing these things but it helps me realize the limits.
It doesn't look as if you're doing anything wrong. Quite the opposite. But, as I hint above, setups will not alter tire models (which is, objectively, the sum of both the mathematical-physical model imprinted into equations and algorithms - offlimits to us - and the calibration of that model (or models).
Sometimes - not saying this is the case - people confuse setups with the whole physics of a car or a racing sim, which is obviously wrong.
One exaggerated example is in the files, I allowed the tire pressure settings to be able to give me the lowest possible psi I know which in real life is like running flat already. That's 10psi. In the game I simulate a flat left front tire, gave it 10psi only, all the others are stock GTR Evo setup. But I did not "feel" any change at all[...]
Hmm...I have never experienced that. It sure looks odd.
I have seen however someone complaining of something similar (so to speak) and it was due to a...sneaky issue: this person had GTR EVO from Steam and no matter what he did, he could effect any change to the car physics. This is due to the fact that the steam version of the game engine seeks a certain folder structure and if something here fails, it reverts to original, unchanged physics files.
I am trying to revert my GTR Evo back to RACE07 only, but I think I cannot because my RACE07 is not the standalone pack when I got it.[...].
GTR EVO may be installed as a stand-alone or an expansion pack. If it is a stand-alone, it will install Race07.
The contents of Race07 and GTR Evo differ just as I explained earlier.
You shouldn't need to revert back to Race07, as the Race07 contents, if you didn't touch them, are still there in its original state.
By the way, lots of appreciation for your time in helping me out. I don't mind reading a lot if I learn a lot from what I read. Thanks and more power to you.
isiMotor2 based racing sims really are like your run of the mill iceberg: you only see the tip but you know there's a lot beneath the surface. So, lots of things to write about when we're trying to help someone.
Originally Posted by WildBill
Chronus----if you read this
I'm modelling the physics for a 50's mod---both in rFactor and GTR2
The one thing Iwould like to finalize would be differentiating between a car with early discs and another with drum brakes----ok---let's say Jag D type and Maserati 300s---now the drum brakes at that period were[...]
Hmm...good question. Not a simple one, I suspect. And you probably know more about this than I do.
First off, there are differences between isiMotor2 v1.250 and GTR2's version. The Brake Response Curve allows for a less limiting simulation of brake behaviour in regards to changes in temperature, as you know.
Secondly, lets say from the 50s onwards...Brake fade was a problem with both drum and early discs. Only with "space age" materials did we begin to see this problem recede or be almost eliminated.
Picking a known example, the deTomaso Pantera.
Early models featured brake discs already (at least, judging from several sources I read). But they were seriously prone to failure and had a quick fade. Later models replaced the early solid discs by ventilated discs, and brake behaviour improved significantly.
How to simulate the above? Disregarding the very useful brake response curve featured in isiMotor2 v.1250 (not found in GTR2), I'd say:
- optimum for early discs of the Pantera could be around 470, while later (ventilated) discs could reach 550 or slightly more.
- Cooling should be higher for ventilated discs as well by comparison to solid units.
- Wear rate of early units was also higher, as was also their failure rate.
In general, and correct me if this is not so...
- Lower optimum temperatures and lower cooling capacity.
- Brake Fade Range could be used to either extend the effects of excessive heat or replicate what happens when brakes are too cold.
- Brake heating (heat added linearly with torque) should also be higher, which combined with lower cooling abilities contributed to overheat and brake fade.
In regards to Brake Fade Range specifically, it depends on what's more significant: brake grip halving due to brakes being too cold or too hot. Maybe setting this to a couple hundred degrees higher than optimum could replicate the behaviour intended by v1.250's BrakeResponseCurve //<cold>,<min_optimum>,<max_optimum>,<hot