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Unread 19 May 17, 12:37   #151
Guimengo
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ps: I don't understand how this is deemed a good promotional image

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Unread 19 May 17, 12:56   #152
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mm it is not that bad just reverse to most everything you see

Most pics have car in foreground in sharp focus and everything else is blurred

I like rF2 look, said it time and time again, over in far distance look how well defined the track, sign and fencing is, it looks natural in other new gen Post Process stuff like that looks less defined and smudgy looking

The thing that still lets rF2 landscape down is the clouds, I said it years back and got absolutely canned at ISI forum lmao

Even though they said they have improved them in DX11 imho they till have that ill defined 2D look about them


But I can't say that can I ?
I am not a cloud expert or pro photographer or race-car driver ( rolls eyes ) lol
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Unread 19 May 17, 14:14   #153
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The skies have always been bad in rFactor. In rF1 it was solved with high-res images created by others, in rF2 it needs color correction, increase in resolution and volume of the clouds.
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Unread 19 May 17, 14:14   #154
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Yeah, the clouds never did really improve....... I also wish there were more historic/classic tracks.....
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Unread 19 May 17, 14:40   #155
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LOL, feeling down Gui?

I raced with REVS on Tuesday. GT3 Camaro at Portugal for 45 minutes using DX9 and then watched the replay in DX11... damn, that looks fantastic! The problems with rF2 DX11 at this time are the low performance and the sometimes silly replay camera choices. What works well in the visuals are all those trackside details that AC doesn't include; unfortunately the performance is 40% of AC and adding a field of AI can drop that to 30% of AC, so single GPU triple screens with Ultra is not playable.

Best suggestion on triples is to run race with no PP since PP is not used in cockpit view anyways, then watch replay on single screen with Ultra PP.

The AC lovers will rightfully declare rF2's car details are lacking. It's a design tradeoff and AC have got the right balance for performance, but their image is lackluster unless you only focus on the car.
***

Yeah, I have to agree that particular Zandvoort image is not exactly enticing. Apart from the obvious, I get tired of the traditional ISI grass color that never changes between locations and I could swear there should be buildings on that skyline from this point of view and how often is Zandvoort ever that sunny?!?... yet I'm still looking forward to an official Zandvoort.
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Unread 19 May 17, 14:46   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emery View Post
LOL, feeling down Gui?


Hehe. I've not done any driving in a few weeks and was hoping to have something enticing to change that. Still no desire . And after spending time away "only with real life," it is always tough to return to a videogame and look for immersion, especially rF2, which sadly is the one game I wanted to enjoy playing the most. Well, when AC first came around it replaced that hope but that thought was short-lived, by mid-2014 it was back to reality.

Edit: I also think that the official forum is so riddled with groupthink that it exacerbates the frustration as I just miss honest and realistic statements and expectations .

Last edited by Guimengo; 19 May 17 at 14:57.
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Unread 19 May 17, 15:50   #157
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Just did hour race at Palm Beach starting at dusk 5x time 5x fuel

Was great fun and I don't really even like these classes but ya can't test night in a F3 lol

Looks good enough for me

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Unread 20 May 17, 22:11   #158
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I fired the game again, all latest Dx11 build. Still unimpressed but I suppose the overstated hype negatively impacted that. Sad to report the Celica GTO has dashboard issues and would need updating, but since 32_Pixels has been gone since release, we (me) are out of luck.
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Unread 20 May 17, 23:02   #159
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rF2 hype

hahaha

Funny one G

Anyone had/has pCars and AC that would be the pot calling the kettle black lol
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Unread 21 May 17, 00:41   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DurgeDriven View Post
rF2 hype

hahaha

Funny one G

Anyone had/has pCars and AC that would be the pot calling the kettle black lol
Currently there are a couple of people trying to bring forth constructive feedback, the devs usually never respond unless it's one confronting users (and funnily going silent when wrong), but the usual peeps are actively pushing against the current of development. They sang Dx11 praises and built up their hype and the game obviously doesn't deliver against their words.
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Unread 21 May 17, 01:50   #161
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
Currently there are a couple of people trying to bring forth constructive feedback, the devs usually never respond unless it's one confronting users (and funnily going silent when wrong), but the usual peeps are actively pushing against the current of development. They sang Dx11 praises and built up their hype and the game obviously doesn't deliver against their words.
You had the VR crowd and the candy crowd at ISI forums hehehe

pCars2 drove like NFS they would still sell 50,000

rF2 drove like NFS they be lucky to sell any

Ironic don't ya think


Want my opinion same as 2+ years ago, ISI should have started rF3 back then.

Same as today imho S397 want to early release something at least hint at it

Go the AC route, do a slow trickle of beta car and track etc etc etc

They could have done Zandvoort for it

I love rF2 but anymore investment is like shovelling shite up hill without a barrow lol
ie: I don't think they can turn around sentiment enough to matter but a brand new sim
might do it.

Or is S397 going to hold up the we are just sim lovers we are not into money caper
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Unread 21 May 17, 02:06   #162
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About number of copies sold with the exact same product, I'd not find it ironic. Given the product is the same for both then it's the marketing that would impact its market share, and you know which one of the two would invest to move the units .

Studio 397 is going to make money from old owners being forced to buy new licenses, existing owners rebuying "just because it's not too expensive", and above all from a focus on developing new, paid content. I don't expect much additional investment since S397 already inherited the artists' payroll but they can't just sit and do nothing, or they'll not capitalize on what they could make from new content. So it is in their best interest to iron out the main faults left from ISI though their ability to do so may be questionable since it's quite a few of the same people who already hadn't sorted things out.

ps: I am looking forward to Sergio Loro's Zandvoort .
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Unread 21 May 17, 05:20   #163
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Yeah ......dreamy slow-mo of rain flowing across cars polished to a mirror and you just sold xxxxx copies hehehe

AC don't need a video they just mention a car model and people go warm and fuzzy

By contrast the moment I saw that first ISI Historic video all that caught my eye was the chassis ......... " It's Alive !@! "

lol
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Unread 21 May 17, 14:59   #164
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It better look alive, it's a little cylinder attached to the tires through naked suspension arms. If you don't see motion, you're in 1996 .
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Unread 21 May 17, 21:35   #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
It better look alive, it's a little cylinder attached to the tires through naked suspension arms. If you don't see motion, you're in 1996 .

Yeah well watch a video Lotus 49 on Italy Oval the thing barely moves !@!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=keh0josnYBU

lol


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Unread 21 May 17, 21:57   #166
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That thing is moving except when its under a lot of load through the cornering of the oval and it's already compressed all the way down. rF2 historics are softer than real life too.
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Unread 22 May 17, 01:21   #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
That thing is moving except when its under a lot of load through the cornering of the oval and it's already compressed all the way down. rF2 historics are softer than real life too.

What I was meaning as well the reactions do not look like they connected
with actual bumps


Look at Cadwell of course depends on suspension settings I know but here
is basically what I see any pCars 49 video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzL3JA3rSOk

Weird A arm movement for mine almost like it is waves on ocean, none of that millisecond rattle on bumps like Eve. The movement looks more like it reacts to elevations then anything.

I dunno about that G try the F3 at Belgium with max spring fast rebound

It is not just bumps in rF2, it is inertia as well


Watch in this video @1:30 under hard acceleration how Jim's front suspension flatten when he exits Druids and the sharp angle of A arms when he again lifts off for Graham Hill bend

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQgL45VFl8o

I think rF2 looks closer to that
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Unread 22 May 17, 01:27   #168
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The pCars rip of Papyrus Spa lol ( tell me that is not identical map ) lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sB1yZzZhxlQ

Suspension barely moves again
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Unread 22 May 17, 02:40   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DurgeDriven View Post
The pCars rip of Papyrus Spa lol ( tell me that is not identical map ) lol

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sB1yZzZhxlQ

Suspension barely moves again
I lined the 2 up in you tube. Backgrounds are similar but look updated but the road curve at Eau Rouge is exact same. Line them both up from near the start finish tower on pit straight .


Is old Spa a Pcars 1 track ? I never got far into the game because of too much tinsel .

Last edited by pistoncup; 22 May 17 at 03:16.
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Unread 22 May 17, 03:10   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pistoncup View Post
I lined the 2 up in you tube. Backgrounds are similar but look updated but the road curve at Eau Rouge is exact same. Line them both up from near the start finish tower on pit straight .


The Chinese are making PCARS2 now ?
I think that was only the beta probably never had another map to use maybe they paid iRacing to use I dunno

Look at Malmedy Chicane " the roller coaster " look is the same


I asked the same thing of VLM and F1C Rouen, got banned just for asking what data they used because to me it looked like GPL and they gave no credit and referred to it as "scratch built"

pCars Rouen seems to follow Papyrus too closely
Turn 1 for instance the track drops away too late too shallow and turns in too soon .........all conversions since then have followed the same including rF2 Rouen.

But eyeball Historic photos how steep it was and you see more off a downhill straight before you attack Turn 1

http://8w.forix.com/rouen/68-ickx-su...driguez-f1.jpg

Errors with GPL maps were well covered in early GPL threads
Why 15 years later they still use the same is beyond me

Put the original GPL Spa and the new GPL Spa and ISI Belgium side by side
Like I said imho GPL modders got Kemmel kink and Les Combe approach more right then ISI

Last edited by DurgeDriven; 22 May 17 at 03:21.
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Unread 22 May 17, 04:09   #171
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P.S. Glad you got me thinking about Historic Tracks p

Zandvoort changed much in it's upgrades over the years and we not getting a 60's version are we

1948 Zandvoort GP - Prince Bira (Maserati 4cl) 1st leads Tony Rolt (Aitken Alfa-Romeo) 2nd


Check the history https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circuit_Park_Zandvoort
The black and white , awesome pic
Also original 30's layout would be cool



OT:

Anyways glad you reminded me because I want to undertake a radical idea with GPL + CCM + Historic carsets

I going to make JSGME mods of totally separate GEMS
1 pre-patched GPL ( 7 slots ) so I can use Camera Control Master
and another one with Historic carsets setup

I also had trouble changing carsets and folders with multi GPL folders and Gem

This way they be totally dependent one click to install either Gem including documents folders without stuffing anything up .........hopefully




And to finish on topic..........I wish we had this many mods in rF2 ! lol

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Unread 22 May 17, 09:23   #172
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Found a new use for JSGME

4.4GB of skins in a click




Now course I just realized I going to have to re-path all the updated ISI cars.... ....doh

Any issues running old skins in DX11 for Celica, Lola etc ?


EDIT:

Doh
Better with OVGME as rFactor2 unlike other gmotor titles does not have file overwrites
Plus you can store in Sim archives rather then Steam
Includes 11GB of Non-Steam circuits too


Last edited by DurgeDriven; 22 May 17 at 10:26.
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Unread 22 May 17, 16:55   #173
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pCARS Rouen was a joke. I provided a bunch of reference material but they clearly weren't using any. All available Rouen's are off and Virtua_LM's looks like a collage of the first 2-3 layouts with the typical inaccuracy of a mid-2000's track.
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Unread 23 May 17, 10:43   #174
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Gui -

You had asked what cars ISI licensed that hadn't been released. This is the list I had compiled last year:
Brabham BT44 [Released as work-in-progress]
Eagle Mk1
Ford Maverick [Released as Howston Dissenter, not actually licensed]
Nissan GT-R GT500 [Released by Studio 397] plus "pretty likely to have a competitor"
Corvette Daytona Prototype
2015 ISI Formula Masters
2003 Bentley Speed 8
Toleman TG184
Mercedes-Benz 300 SLR
Mercedes-Benz W196
Reynard 95i
March 86C
Cooper T54
Eagle Mk4
Panoz Esperante GTR-1
Panoz Esperante GTLM GT2
"at least one F1 from every decade"
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Unread 23 May 17, 22:54   #175
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Thanks, Emery! I forgot the specific Group C cars they had too but some of it was also privileged information. And I believe two more F1 cars.
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Unread 23 May 17, 23:30   #176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
pCARS Rouen was a joke. I provided a bunch of reference material but they clearly weren't using any. All available Rouen's are off and Virtua_LM's looks like a collage of the first 2-3 layouts with the typical inaccuracy of a mid-2000's track.
That is all I was saying back then G
There was reference material at the time @RSC that VLM could have used

They had members actually raced /drove and walked the Historic tracks

I guess it would take GPL modders to do it as proper as humanly possible

Funny how laser scanned means no one will ever dispute track layout
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Unread 23 May 17, 23:48   #177
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iRacing has some issues with some of their laser scanned tracks where the elevation is off. The corner radius, camber, blabla is ok but the elevation on straights apparently not. Watkins Glen is one of the tracks affected.
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Unread 25 May 17, 16:55   #178
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The usual few people who miss the point are now fully present in a topic about the skies. The thing takes two thirds of the screen and some people still say it doesn't matter, this and that, blabla you suck, regardless of being factually wrong. And they just don't get it.
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Unread 26 May 17, 06:22   #179
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Next it'll be back to running water, puddles and aquaplaning lol



I would like a new gmotor engine with less content and no 3rd party till it was finished ............... early release I rather pay $100 for that.

Forget the night and rain till you get it right
For a start real road linked to drying lines is horrible


Keep seeing temperature, wind direction and wind speed in dedicated menu that does zilch for 5 years ...........but that is what I interested in

The tangibles ! what full working dynamics to environment could add to a race

Better clutch transmission too

Make multi version UI which are fully customized to suit the actual series and/or experience levels

1. Normal has full menus
2. Pro get rid of 1/2 the menus you don't need and/or are unrealistic
3. Historic ... would not have launch control etc etc
4. GT3 would have sequential if you want to drive them stick use the Normal Ui
5. F1 would have DRS etc etc

etc etc Having every series menu tailored so you couldn't pick a unusable setting
( like Pit Limiter in a Historic ) or have greyed out boxes everywhere.
It would be neater and more functional
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Unread 26 May 17, 14:43   #180
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You want a sandbox engine but you want a full package. You want it complete but you want early access. You want functional things but you want ISI. And you've posted all this before a few times .
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Unread 26 May 17, 20:36   #181
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I think Durge feels you don't get what you don't ask for, LOL!
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Unread 27 May 17, 03:11   #182
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I just saying I rather things like that over 100 extra cars or eye candy

Not want or need just looking forward to it.

Look at iRacing what wind dynamics could do for Oval Racing

You been listening to Indy for weeks every day someone mentions how wind
comes it play, Formula 1 as well

So heat and wind is just as bigger part in the overall scheme as anything else.


So really we all still driving arcade
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Unread 4 June 17, 07:43   #183
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To go along with post #174 here, I found an ooooooollld blog entry from Tim Wheatley about official promised rF2 content, from over 5.5 years ago.

http://twhtly.net/20922

"Grand Prix racing in the 1960’s was a mixture of bravery that bordered on recklessness and, contrary to what many may say, innovative design and technology, far from primitive, which led Formula One to where it is today.

It was an era when the human eye, instead of a computer and a wind tunnel, designed a beautiful car. It was an era where spectators and drivers were only protected by bales of hay, which were often more likely to attribute to a fire than to save you in an impact.

Risks were taken and lives were lost, but the romance of the era still remains been the target of software developers, TV documentaries, and Hollywood movies. Many, including those of us at ISI, consider this space in time to be a golden age in the history of motorsport.

The racing game/sim community (console, or PC), mention certain content in their forums, twitters and blogs, they get excited about particular turns like Eau Rouge, the Corkscrew, etc. This often means they receive a cookie-cutter set of tracks from every racing game because – that’s what they ‘asked’ for.

Even when a developer does take a big risk and do something different, there are sometimes decisions made to incorporate those important turns. For example, an inclusion of the modern and recognizable Eau Rouge, incorrect for the period, into the 1998 PC title, Grand Prix Legends.

While we understand that our open modding nature allows it to negate some of that risk, it is important to realize that racing games often give difference in content, and often there is little to no risk for the developer in terms of content appreciation from the customer. Until, that is, they get bored of the same tracks all the time…

The first in-game/sim screenshot of rFactor 2 released to the public was of a road lined with trees, a house on the right and a truck parked in its driveway. This, barely recognizable to us as the same track now, was the first indication that ISI were trying to do something different.

We have licensed content from the modern era of motorsport for multiple types of racing, but also have licensing deals for real content from the first four decades of Formula One (some in the initial release, some to come later). We’ve done this because this is what we love and this is what we want to bring to the racing game/sim community."

So we have 1 official car released, 1 in beta development limbo. Missing 1950's and 1980's.






Here, another mention of content but in the plural and specific on two seasons. Of that, nothing was delivered yet.

http://twhtly.net/20929

"rFactor 2 will have cars from between 1966 and 1969 included in the open beta. Some will be licensed, others will be generic ‘grid fillers’. Of these cars, some will be F1, some F2 and some F3. You can have these cars all on the track at the same time if you want to."






There's more posting there too referring to a focus on accurate, historic content. So, do any of you here believe we will be graced with S397 making good on the earlier, official rF2 promises?
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Unread 4 June 17, 10:08   #184
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I thought making Gasoline Alley 3PA was somehow a replacement for the Indy 500 Cars
they talked about

Try to be optimistic but years asking when they would fix basic glitches in the F3's
and never being answered wore me down lol

Pains me to do 120% races and watch Eve AI endlessly valve bouncing in 4th gear
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Unread 4 June 17, 15:44   #185
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One of the things that happens when a company changes hands is that they can ignore past promotional promises.

At this point, I'm not sure how many of the 3-5 year old licenses are even valid. Tim mentioned that some were expiring around the time the concept of TPA was being floated, before TPA became official. Any Panoz agreements are probably older than dirt, as I think those date back to 1998 timeframe for SCGT.

Plus there will be new priorities for content now that we're 5 years into the future in terms of racecars. LMP, for instance looks completely different than it did in 2012. GT3, for the USA market, wasn't even a thing back in 2012.

So honestly, for content, I think some historic material will trickle out, but the priority is going to be on new F1 & LMP technologies (hybrids) to keep up with AC. It's also not clear who is doing the physics these days...
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Unread 4 June 17, 17:34   #186
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The name of the game was retained so the licenses would remain valid. I know S397 can decide their future and don't necessarily inherit ISI's promises and failures, so I actually think the good stuff we once were promised will be discarded in favor of more recent material and licenses, nearly all aimed towards paid DLC. Also older existing content will get phased out from the game like the 2010 F-Renault that has been discarded, but probably just the stuff related to rF1 like Sardian Heights, Kodi, Montréal, and the "experiments."
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Unread 5 June 17, 21:00   #187
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Durge, have you considered reaching out to CrossPly or vive_mclaren about an unofficial historics update, even if just fixing the immediate problems with the Spark and the Eve (F1-F3 editions)?
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Unread 7 June 17, 11:31   #188
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Quote:
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Durge, have you considered reaching out to CrossPly or vive_mclaren about an unofficial historics update, even if just fixing the immediate problems with the Spark and the Eve (F1-F3 editions)?
Me, no I just go with the flow man

You see new bug with suspension in Eve shaking like madman


btw you right Emery water and oil temp are at least canned to air temperature, but even more so the brakes ........

Reason it was lost on me is F3-Rookies I run with no damage so I don't have to pit every 30 seconds with a newbie lool

So I tried 108F to 72F ambient change (36F ) in a session and had cloud cover to match lol 100% damage etc

Water temp varied virtually identical range 185F to 148F (37F)
Oil ran 10-12F cooler at lower ambient
Brakes were over 50F down in cooler air

I never even bothered with tyre pressure / temp, ran the same laptimes
but more I think cooler air felt better hahaha mirage


Going to have to try full length race at Italy on stinking hot day
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Unread 19 June 17, 19:25   #189
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Found the Le Mans 67 beta for rf2, sure is nice for a beta! LOVE the older tracks with the new graphics engines........
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Unread 28 June 17, 23:41   #190
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Quote:
Our goal is always 'realism'. We use the most amount of real data possible, and have a highly advanced tire model. Cars have evolved since the early days, so you really can't compare because many of those do not or did not have the CPM tire.
Quote:
Chris, seeing as you are here, can you comment on the current state of the tyre model for the historic cars? We never seem to get any updates on it. Will the CPM and chassis flex ever be added?
Deafening Silence

lol


So all CPM cars are easier to drive then Non-CPM .....never knew that ?

No wonder the new Howston was so drive-able on Woo's Lemans

...........then whatever you do S397 !@!
I begging, please don't touch Historic , just leave it alone !@!



hehehe
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Unread 29 June 17, 15:51   #191
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There's always going to be silence about existing content that sorely needs updating. They'll only talk about upcoming work, etc, and move on from problems. I hope whatever programmers are in the project are super busy with new graphics and other core fixes because it makes no sense for there to be so little work done by the artists.
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Unread 29 June 17, 22:04   #192
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Goes without saying I know


------------------

Historic need redoing ground up

Serious, official content that has light poking through gaps between wheel and tyre is not a good look 5 years down the track
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Unread 30 June 17, 18:10   #193
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Another OT moment and minor rant: some leftover members of the community are so idiotic, blind and/or frustrating they don't understand how they are part of the reason for the lack of quality third-party support. People don't want to get involved .


Done.
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Unread 1 July 17, 00:28   #194
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Ranting aside, the Radical SR3 has been officially released:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfil.../?id=950759997
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Unread 1 July 17, 02:14   #195
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DurgeDriven View Post
I just saying I rather things like that over 100 extra cars or eye candy

Not want or need just looking forward to it.

Look at iRacing what wind dynamics could do for Oval Racing

You been listening to Indy for weeks every day someone mentions how wind comes it play, Formula 1 as well

So heat and wind is just as bigger part in the overall scheme as anything else.


So really we all still driving arcade

.....from ProjectCars 2 details

Quote:
Wind, meanwhile, can play havoc with your open-wheel, aero’-dependent IndyCar—getting a tail wind on a crisp morning in October into Turn 1 that has yet to be warmed by the sun is the kind of racing that will make Project CARS 2 both challenging and viscerally unforgettable".
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Unread 1 July 17, 03:42   #196
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Durge, compare images of both games running the same car

http://www.racedepartment.com/downlo...der-rf2.16043/
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Unread 1 July 17, 04:09   #197
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Yeah very nice job
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Unread 1 July 17, 06:46   #198
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I hope toebee is doing well with the Riverside conversion. That will be a nice track to have in rF2.
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Unread 3 July 17, 17:05   #199
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So apparently the drag is way off and the tires need a full rebuild (Radical SR3-RSX). I'm truly surprised the first S397-made release came out with these flaws, it does seem Michael B. didn't touch this car... or didn't even give feedback because I'm sure he'd have noticed things if other people did. This makes no sense . And the testing team also seems to have further dropped in quality.
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Unread 3 July 17, 18:25   #200
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Definitely not a shining example of how to release new content. I'm still observing rather than commenting, because I can't tell how much was self-imposed "deadline pressure" and how much is the result of poor internal process. I'd like to think that deadline pressure is the reason, but...
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