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Unread 26 September 17, 00:33   #151
syhlif32
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I tried Pcars 2 at a neighbor a couple of days ago. He got nearly the same setup as I do except the monitor.
I did enjoy Pcars1 from time to time but have not had it installed since April and have not missed it.

At first I thought that Pc2 was just more of the same. More like an minor update to #1
But after a couple of hours I started to like it more.
The graphics are good as expected. Weather is pretty spectacular made!

Physics and FFB I didn't like to begin with. But after a while you get used to the FFB and it is actually quite good even on a G27.

Ai is like PC1 very inconsistent some tracks and Mod combination they are pretty good while other got major issues and not just the first corner!

I really want to wait to see if they improve the AI but also excited about trying it is VR.

Think that a lot of the negative comments are from people (like me) that got very disappointed about PC1 and carry that over to PC2.
Should they have fixed PC1? Yes it was a huge disappointment for me they didn't fix FFB and AI.
Which is why I will hold back on purchase #2 until I see an AI patch.
Was it $20 I would buy right away and hope they will fix the issue.
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Unread 2 October 17, 18:10   #152
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Ok I did not wait, bought it Friday.
Have not regretted it at all.
Vr is the best of any race sim game Not sure why but display is much clearer and looks more high res than any of the other sims I have tried.
RF2 is pretty good with VR but PC2 are a level or two up and runs fine on my gtx 970 which is borderline on RF2 in VR.
It also looks and feels good on my monitor.
Been hot lapping mainly in order to try out the cars and tracks and there are a lot.
I like the physics and FFB!
Find on the tracks some of the textures could have been better mainly trees and grass but the rest looks just great.
The Nordschleife is visual the best I have seen. And alone that was worth the price.

Hope PC2 continue to impress me when I start to race MP and AI?
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Unread 2 October 17, 20:02   #153
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I watched Matt Orr's video and it solidifies it as a non-purchase for me. I don't believe SMS will rectify the nagging issues as they seem to still be tweaked from the core built 9 years ago. And the non-trackside replay graphics still don't impress me, the flatness of the textures has always stuck out.
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Unread 2 October 17, 20:21   #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
I watched Matt Orr's video and it solidifies it as a non-purchase for me. I don't believe SMS will rectify the nagging issues as they seem to still be tweaked from the core built 9 years ago. And the non-trackside replay graphics still don't impress me, the flatness of the textures has always stuck out.
I since had a run of the Historics and what I thought would be a new Spa
but to my disappointment was the same roller coaster

If anything the graphic look worse there, trees in distance look they been taken from a golf sim

Yes the physics do feel better, so ? still don't hold a candle to rF2 in any shape or form
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Unread 2 October 17, 22:14   #155
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[QUOTE]If anything the graphic look worse there, trees in distance look they been taken from a golf sim

Yes the physics do feel better, so ? still don't hold a candle to rF2 in any shape or form/QUOTE]

Hey I got two golf simulators (software) and the trees looks better in both than any race sim. Even the one is 8 years old

Can't hold a candle to RF2 I do not agree with. If you said the best cars in RF2 are better than the best cars in PC2 physics wise I would agree but let's not forget that the complete utterly missing consistency in RF2 so on average I think that PC2 holds up pretty good.

No offence Gui, but base opinions on a youtube is ridiculous and a youtube by Empty box is way beyond ridiculous!
But yes the textures in the distance are of too low resolution on some (many) tracks.
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Unread 2 October 17, 22:53   #156
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Maybe it's only in Historics
The physics are like you have 5% latitude

Driving through Burnenville was one handed and no feeling totally devoid of any immersion

They still have immovable objects like hay-bales but silly physics for the posts around track which they put far too many to be historically correct also.

You hit post and they fling up in the air ridiculous same canned movement

every post in rF2 is unique how they spin and fall but in pCars it's just canned baloney

You can drive straight into 10 poles and just run over them, there is no movement no physical just nothing ! Try it

In rF2 posts can lift a wheel off the ground and crash you unceremoniously
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Unread 3 October 17, 07:21   #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syhlif32 View Post
No offence Gui, but base opinions on a youtube is ridiculous and a youtube by Empty box is way beyond ridiculous!
He's an acquaintance from going on about 13 years who is good at articulating his sentiments without trying to get technical, speaking without knowledge. He proved himself more in touch with the games (car handling, force feedback and other game aspects) than nearly all testers from the games I participated in, and through many discussions over time when he'd ask things about two specific games, we were in agreement over a multitude of areas.

Mind you that my experiences and commentary were validated by the people who matter, and by extension, Matt's more dedicated layman's approach and thoughts have proved extremely on point. That's a summary as to why he's someone whose opinion I can accept as valid without needing first-hand experience with the racing game .
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Unread 8 October 17, 14:19   #158
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Gui, you are right you can use any means you think are right to form your opinions.
I was just surprised you used Empty Box as you always come across as well informed! And that is not my impression of him. And never will be after his involvement in GSCE/AMS. That smelled of paid opinion

Just saw his youtube and I can tell you lot of the stuff he complains about are in the game he just doesn't know! He could have got that info on the forums had he cared!
Had he said it was to hard to find I would have agreed.

Regarding VR you will not find many that doesn't think that PC2 VR are the best in any Race sim.

The AI are suddenly not what SMS promised but after the first corner they are better than most other race sims.
The tires got issues and I agree the historics cars are rubbish special compared to RF2.
Some cars select the wrong tires in the rain I assume some Ai cars does too?

The flat textures I agree with on some cars and tracks. It can be improved on Ultra settings. Now that is clearly also wrong that it is needed but textures get noticeable better on Ultra settings also the trees in the distance.

Physics and driving are for the most very good.
Try the Mitsubishi EVO iX it got as close to perfect physics and FFB as I have ever felt in a race sim.

My main grip with PC2 are the same as with all newer sims including RF2 they lack something I can't define?
But I get tired of them after 1/2 to one hour of use while I can send 3-4 hours or even more with Gtr2/GTL and special with P&G.
The exception is the historics in RF2. I can spend a lot of time there too!

But honestly people should wait on a proper fix for the AI and tires and maybe a sale before they buy Project Cars 2.
Not sure how beta testers/ SMS could have overlooked those faults?
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Unread 8 October 17, 19:49   #159
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He was not involved with GSCE or AMS. I was never paid for any of the involvement in games and I got dozens of sales for a few different games from my videos and running leagues, though I'm not an internet personality. The thing with Matt is ability to notice, pick-up on things, from car feel to other aspects, and verbalize it. It's not about details, technical ability and verbose.

With pC2 given everything Slightly Mad Studios, a review update should be done come November or December by these media outlets. I'm sure there will have been a couple of patches by then, and no excuse can be used.
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Unread 11 October 17, 22:14   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
ability to notice, pick-up on things, from car feel to other aspects, and verbalize it..................
verbalize it ................AC Historic feel like simcade compared to rF2 Historics

and the first thing you pick up with AC Historics is they feel totally devoid
of anything makes them feel somewhat believable in rF2


Quote:
Can't hold a candle to RF2 I do not agree with. If you said the best cars in RF2 are better than the best cars in PC2 physics wise I would agree
Well that is all I have ever imitated

same as rF2 can't hold a candle to the AC models
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Unread 16 October 17, 11:35   #161
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After the update this week the historics feels better got new tires as far as I understand?
Still not as good as the RF2 historics.
The fps feels more smooth after the update.

Have not tried a lot of other cars so have no idea if the update was a general improvement over all tracks and cars.
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Unread 16 October 17, 22:21   #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DurgeDriven View Post
Maybe it's only in Historic

They still have immovable objects like hay-bales but silly physics for the posts around track which they put far too many to be historically correct also.

You hit post and they fling up in the air ridiculous same canned movement

every post in rF2 is unique how they spin and fall but in pCars it's just canned baloney

You can drive straight into 10 poles and just run over them, there is no movement no physical just nothing ! Try it

In rF2 posts can lift a wheel off the ground and crash you unceremoniously
I got a post stuck between the front wheel and the body and I swear it was made from polystyrene...and the hay bales, they must have cows with steel teeth....
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Unread 17 October 17, 01:17   #163
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Default Pcars great potential

I love rFactor 1 Historic Gt and the F1 66 beta mod. sixties tracks like riverside great fun. mkiv in pcars is awesome. Force feedbadk best ever. the key is it takes a long time to configure but once you do it feels like the next generation of sim racing. I just kid an ai race at historic spa with ai set to 120 with max aggression. Ithink the ai is every bit as good maybe even better than gtr2 or rfactor both of which I dearly love.
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Unread 17 October 17, 03:10   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimmyC View Post
Force feedbadk best ever. the key is it takes a long time to configure but once you do it feels like the next generation of sim racing.
Sounds exactly like what us oldtimers said about rF2 in 2013. Considering pCARS 2 is using similar technology, it is no surprise.

Quote:
I just kid an ai race at historic spa with ai set to 120 with max aggression. Ithink the ai is every bit as good maybe even better than gtr2 or rfactor both of which I dearly love.
You really need to experience good AI to understand how crappy pCARS 2 AI is. pCARS 2 AI can't merge from the start formation, they cut corners, and are extremely shy about passing the human player such that you have to use max aggression and then they'll just ram you if you're the slightest bit slow rather than taking advantage to gain position and if they do take the position cleanly they just hand it back. The AI will stack up behind you and not race each other. You'll see them riding around the apron in oval racing and randomly weaving across the track.

The AI in AMS and rF2 are far better.
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Unread 17 October 17, 14:32   #165
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Quote:
He was not involved with GSCE or AMS
He was very much involved during the crowdfunding and special the voting period.
And that is my last comment about him.

Have no comment to people that are obsessed with the way hayballs fly and not caring about a proper clutch model.
I was completely surprised and dump stuck when I got back to RF2 that it still had no working clutch!

Emery is as usual right that the AI still have a long way to go. Not sure that are quite as bad as he states but each of us have our own experience.
I have been rammed plenty by AI in both RF2 and AMS. And while the Ai in general are good in RF2 I have not very good experiences with AI in AMS. Only using F Vee and vintage F1 in AMS.

Talking down one sim might make you feel better. But it is not gonna make you favorite sim any better!
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Unread 17 October 17, 16:13   #166
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He was not involved in the team. He was not a developer, he was not staff, he wasn't anything. Everything he did was out of his own will, such as crowdfunding and fortunately for him I'd say he didn't have an interest in testing and seeing things from the inside. I was interested in investing more than just the crowdfunding but from what I knew about Renato and how poorly he carried himself especially the months before and during crowdfunding, I became quite reticent of giving any money regardless of what was promised. Regarding his sponsorship from Niels, I have absolutely no doubt it was mostly driven by his positive words before even considering his increased channel following.

I don't have a favorite "technical aspects" sim. My favorite racing titles are GPL and NR 2003. GPL because it's an interesting package and has great community updates, so it's still appealing to play and immersive. NR 2003 because of the Redline GTP mod. Everything else, I have no favorites.

I do wish R3E to develop into what they have promised but have no expectations of such. I can just as readily provide positive and negative words of feedback for the other racing titles which I've tried. I've not touched pCARS 2 but I do know what to look for from previous experience with 3 SMS titles, as well as being an active member in the WMD forum. You may have seen words from me regarding a wish to actually see pC2 deliver on most fronts. I have no stake in any company and instead would like to see a movement towards improved quality and experience in these games I enjoy, and which are nearly stagnant.
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Unread 18 October 17, 01:21   #167
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syhlif32 View Post
Have no comment to people that are obsessed with the way hayballs fly and not caring about a proper clutch model.
I care about a proper clutch always have but it's not just rF2 is it
No clutch in any sim I have driven is sufficient so I don't understand
pigeon holing rF2


If Assetto Corsa or ProjectCARS did a big update...... added free roam drive-able outfields, models and terrain allow climbing stairs and woodpiles, movable posts and barriers that interact with all cars, breakable signs like at Belgium's Malmedy chicane people would praise them ..............ironic
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Unread 18 October 17, 02:25   #168
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My Howston pushing the Clio to 7,500rpm in 6th and 167mph !
Try that in another sim, no I am not saying that makes it more realistic
I just saying all the stuff above in other sims is Fake News lol

So yes I would rather pCars2 have interaction with surroundings
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Unread 18 October 17, 12:06   #169
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Durge, If your particular version doesn't interact with obstacles or do not have a clutch ask for money back as you got a version different from everybody else.
Actual ask for the money back as you clearly do not think much or care to know much about PC2!
Not sure why it is so important to bash all other sims all the time. Apart for AC which have never clicked for me I find all (most) sims got some good points.
Doesn't mean they do not have bugs or faults but what is the point of bashing it here on Nogrip and endlessly promoting RF2 in all threads?
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Unread 26 October 17, 12:44   #170
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emery View Post
The AI in AMS and rF2 are far better.
Ofcourse you are allowed to think that - but check this out with some kind of an open mind

I have no shares in this game but check the AI behaviour out in this video.
I watched the whole video because
1. its pretty exiting and
2. the AI behaviour is some of the best I have seen in any game (rF2 included )

I have to admit that I have allready decided to buy the game - when I have build a PC able to run it
And I therefore have to accept to have my new PC invaded by the Steam BS
Hehe when I now does post the link I think I will watch it again

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mYJeBzFWms0
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Unread 26 October 17, 15:10   #171
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Yes, I watched that video when the patch appeared. It was nice to not see the AI pile up while ignoring a yellow flag condition. On the other hand, note how many AI are running around on the apron! The AI randomly weave around, don't line up to use the draft.

He's having fun, but it ain't much of a race when you go from last to 3rd in less than 5 laps at 85 difficulty, despite his constant declarations of "this is a proper race". It would be pretty silly if he couldn't win in the next 5 laps.
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Unread 26 October 17, 16:12   #172
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emery View Post
..note how many AI are running around on the apron! The AI randomly weave around, don't line up to use the draft.
Sorry english isnt my 1st language. But by apron do you mean they are running outside (to the left of) the track? Or just running low?
"Apron: The paved portion of a racetrack that separates the racing surface from the (usually unpaved) infield."

And to your "randomly weave around" thing I will just say that if you use such "nitpicking" criteria against all other sims their AIs can be assesed flawed (too).

But Im agreeing in most of your comments about the guys outpourings - hehe because its obvious that his oppinion is closely related to his final position in the race.

But at least evaluated from this video the AI in pCars 2 are sometimes able to run pretty good. IMO

ByTheWay: The "fact" that it looks like the AIs dont allways use draft is a pretty high demand against ANY of the existing racing sims AI
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Unread 27 October 17, 14:48   #173
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'Apron' is the flat paved portion inside the banked curve, marked with a white or yellow line. Generally is considered out-of-bounds unless you're going slower than race speed, such as if you are doing a pit entry or are disabled. At Monza before 1970, disabled cars often parked down there!

***
AI drafting is "next generation" capability. We know rF1, rF2, & AMS have parameters that can be tweaked to enhance AI drafting behavior (like SlowWhenPushed and AIDraftStickiness in rF2), but there's certainly another step that could be taken, where the AI actively hunt drafting partners, trying to leapfrog competitors, particularly on a track like Monza or LeMans. Tuning AIDraftStickiness helps that a lot, but the AI currently don't look further down the track to sniff out the next draft.

What you see in pCARS 2 video suggests that pCARS 2 AI have very little AIDraftStickiness (if it even exists), so they pop out way too soon and lose their momentum. The weaving is also very abrupt, as if they can only switch lanes rather than slowly squeeze over or use half lanes.
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Unread 27 October 17, 16:40   #174
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As I said I have no shares in pCars 2 and eventhough I agree in your abrupt weaving critique of the AIs then I can garantee you that if you participate in a iRacing race then you will see more or less exactly the same "abruptness" from most human drivers.
And no Im not even joking.

Hehe its a bit funny watching the youtube drivers comments in the video because its obvious that he interpret some of the abrupt moves from the AIs as they intentionally try to ‎frighten him to stay back.
But on the other side it looks like the AI to some degree does search a drafting line (IMO).
But as you mentions they are not staying into the drafting zone consistently.

One thing that none of us has mentioned is that programming AIs for simple oval driving is a lot easier than getting them to behave foolproof on a roadtrack with both left and right corners.
Hehe and hard braking zones
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Unread 28 October 17, 05:19   #175
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syhlif32 View Post
Durge, If your particular version doesn't interact with obstacles or do not have a clutch ask for money back as you got a version different from everybody else.
Actual ask for the money back as you clearly do not think much or care to know much about PC2!
Not sure why it is so important to bash all other sims all the time. Apart for AC which have never clicked for me I find all (most) sims got some good points.
Doesn't mean they do not have bugs or faults but what is the point of bashing it here on Nogrip and endlessly promoting RF2 in all threads?
I think it is types like you and Duc have the problem not me, I enjoy and own most but I won't be recommending pcars2 to anyone, finito


Quote:
bash all other sims all the time
sounds like a broken record lol

I recommend all gmotor and papyrus titles lol

You can't be serious, in a thread here just recently where a fella wanted the
lowdown on new titles I called AC the " best over all package by far " !

This from rF2 #1 fanboy sorry but it cracks me up lol
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Unread 30 October 17, 14:58   #176
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AI testing - Aggressiveness at 50, 75, & 100
Assessment of AI: "bland"
Note: at least there aren't pileups and minimal shortcuts at chicane.

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Unread 1 November 17, 12:13   #177
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A whole thread in the pCars 2 forum has just been “cleaned” for ANY criticism because someone posted a picture of Steams pCars 2 monthly participation.
And after this “cleaning up” the thread has been locked

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/sho...of-perspective
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Unread 1 November 17, 14:10   #178
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#longevity
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Unread 2 November 17, 16:49   #179
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In relation to this I just saw this not so odd explanation of pCars 2 sales and online numbers in the article: Simracings Eternal Science Project Recap.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zradio7 View Post
That’s actually quite interesting. PC1 sold twice as many copies as AC, but right now the number of players online is dwindling – probably because people moved on to PC2. On the other hand, PC2 so far has sold only 1/10 of PC sales, but half of those players have been online over the last two weeks. If I had to guess, I’d say people are being more careful with their purchase after the endless problems with PC1, but those who actually bought the game are enjoying it so far. With only one fifth of AC owners, PC2 is almost reaching the same online numbers.
https://pretendracecars.net/2017/11/...#comment-64713
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Unread 2 November 17, 20:32   #180
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The decline in initial players shown by pCARS2 is actually pretty normal. According to Steamcharts, AC peaked at around 7000 players at launch and dropped to 2500 a month later, and then continued to fall in the following months to around 1800. What AC have managed to do is then to grow the active user base so that 2.5 years after launch, users are in the region of 2500-3500.
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Unread 2 November 17, 22:35   #181
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Until Nov-Dec 2014, Assetto was extremely bare bones. It began being fleshed out in 2015 which also led fantastic mods to be rendered outdated with regular core changes. But since DreamPack DLC 1, comparisons are extremely valid.
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Unread 2 November 17, 22:39   #182
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Who cares about numbers ? All that matters is what you like !

If anyone wants regular proper online then join a League and stop whining
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Unread 3 November 17, 00:09   #183
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Wright View Post
What AC have managed to do is then to grow the active user base so that 2.5 years after launch, users are in the region of 2500-3500.
Yeah it looks like AC are extremely stable - while its difficult to keep optimism about pCars 2
But at least personally I was astonished by the numbers for F1-07 - because eventhough its target group is slightly different compared to AC and pCars 2 then it will be rather exciting to watch F1-07 on a bit longer terms.
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Unread 3 November 17, 00:43   #184
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Originally Posted by DurgeDriven View Post
Who cares about numbers ? All that matters is what you like !

If anyone wants regular proper online then join a League and stop whining
Unfortunately numbers are affecting leagues. 3 leagues I've joined in the past two years have shuttered shortly after I joined... <sniff> do I really smell that bad?
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Unread 3 November 17, 00:56   #185
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Come on, Durge, you know it doesn't work like that. Leagues are difficult, you need to find good members - or even just race active members - who can drive and keep series alive. 80% of people I've seen online, from leagues to public, aren't good drivers and maybe a third to half of those are overestimating their abilities.
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Unread 3 November 17, 02:09   #186
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Why I asked 5 years ago on ISI for leagues to donate x hours a week
running on various stock content servers to bolster open room numbers
and help drivers what response you think i got

90% said not good drivers in open rooms like they too good for it, then 50% of the 10% left would leave as soon as they got taken out lol

So no wonder is it ?

Even everything ISI did was wrong, green tracks and setting 50% damage for open rooms you expect rookies to go wow this is great lol

Anyways I know I did my bit everyday for years in F3-Rookies
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Unread 3 November 17, 02:30   #187
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It costs money to run servers. 5 years ago I wasn't even around rF2 and I know rF1 modders who had aborted support already. Anyway, you buy a $85 dollar game and still have to spend your time and additional money doing things for the company? You're a point well outside the curve in regards to support and dedication, being more invested than people employed by ISI.
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Unread 3 November 17, 05:57   #188
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I always floated the possibility of being a small fee for maintaining ISI servers and adding teamspk .............. and the reason they are not well used now is there was no thought put into combos, environment, rubber, aids etc etc and having the same 4 car track combo on 4 servers up for weeks on end

I still believe rF2 will go down as an anomaly for all the wrong reasons and none of the good
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Unread 3 November 17, 15:46   #189
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I spent a good 12 months doing all sorts of work for proper hosted sessions. Indycar, F-Renault, historic and modern endurance GTs and LMPs, historic F1s, and recent FWD or Mégane. With simple packaging, thoughtfully made schedules most of the time to fit the cars and quality requirements (you know me).

There were issues from the league side that got in the way such as our forum, which wasn't accessible from tablets, and a registration + TeamSpeak requirement to race. Also most original members (dozen or so) who carried over from Race 07, were 50-70 years old, and it was difficult to get all proper tracks approved by the owners.

When I could get things my way, we still struggled. Indycar and Mégane were the only successful (in absolute terms) leagues we had, especially Indycar bringing 15-17 drivers and a huge influx of interest. I created advertisement posters, posted on forums with detailed information, had carefully set practice, qualifying, and race sessions, and vMod downloads. I even developed a detailed download section in the league's forum. There were still big issues in getting and maintaining interest, and the amount of traffic I could generate on the PRC servers were in the upper echelon of all rF2 servers - which were only locked during our races events -, excluding locked ones from Latin (Spanish or Italian mostly) or Eastern European leagues.

We had too few good tracks, and fewer good tracks that were interesting and well known. Not talking British club tracks for FWD coupes. So track variety was very limited. Then car variety was also limited with only a couple of complete series, and too many mods with balancing and actual visual quality issues. Then there were unfriendly UI issues and users having no help whatsoever from game menus, so support was (and still is) very user-intensive. I rarely practiced because I was busy keeping the forum going, running a multitude of different servers at the same time, and helping members through all sorts of ingame assistance.

The final piece was the crowd. Why do so much work when people would be just as happy still running material from 5-12 years ago, from other games? The way core aspects of the game were described brought in a bunch of folks who would regurgitate words without understanding them. The force feedback was the main force skewing perspective. The same people couldn't tell the difference between mods being straight ports or quality builds. And in the end, only a couple of specific leagues running the same type of content ever maintained traction, because users knew what to expect and were also interested in that car - VEC and FSR, basically. So many others reverted to other games because the simplicity to run things, the lesser amount of variables involved, and available content often more similar in quality, was just a better option.



Tying it now to pCARS or pCARS 2, for all the things it lacks, it has a lot of game-ready content that covers different car and track groups. Even if some track looks bad in relative terms, it has better visuals than rF. Even considering how flat some textures look, which given the overall visual care makes them really jump out in the game.

Last edited by Guimengo; 3 November 17 at 15:56.
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Unread 3 November 17, 17:08   #190
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Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
Tying it now to pCARS or pCARS 2, for all the things it lacks, it has a lot of game-ready content that covers different car and track groups. Even if some track looks bad in relative terms, it has better visuals than rF. Even considering how flat some textures look, which given the overall visual care makes them really jump out in the game.
Content and ease-of-use are king among simracers.

pCARS 2 has very compelling content with the GTE, GT3, Group C, and GTO cars, plus decent (not necessarily great) tracks to run them on. Even though there's a lot of mishmash, it's a better mishmash than AC offers with their 11 DLC packs, especially since AC is woefully short on official tracks and offers no night/weather.

AC appears much stronger on the social aspect, providing a good environment for drifters and supercar fans to hang about.

Where pCARS 2 falls short is not planning ahead on merging all this content with decent AI. Ian Bell says he went balls deep on the features, but apparently had no plan on integrating all the pieces. rF2 isn't so good in that regard, either, though at least it's possible for the end-user to put the pieces together (unlike pCARS 2 where we HAVE to rely on SMS). Best company, so far, for integration is Reiza... the content library is all at the same level and Reiza have proven that they can take lackluster original rF AI and polish it (within a year!) to a level that I feel is now a touch above what rF2 offers.
***
FFB is still too hard for the end user. Everybody and their brother end up tinkering for weeks to get it dialed in and none of the games tell you how it is intended to be configured. They leave it up to you to get it right, without the information of how your controller should likely be configured to get the same experience as the next guy. Thus many people configure their FFB too springy or with clipping or... some other weird feeling, and then these same people will declare that the game's FFB is screwed.
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Unread 3 November 17, 17:27   #191
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When I could get things my way, we still struggled. Indycar and Mégane were the only successful (in absolute terms) leagues we had, especially Indycar bringing 15-17 drivers and a huge influx of interest. I created advertisement posters, posted on forums with detailed information, had carefully set practice, qualifying, and race sessions, and vMod downloads. I even developed a detailed download section in the league's forum. There were still big issues in getting and maintaining interest, ...
My own conclusion conserning this is that among racing sim drivers a lot (most?) want only to TALK about joining a race or a league but for one reason or another never show up when action really are happening.

In short: Afterwards you have to listen to all their laughtable excuses for not being able to show up for the event they signed up for.
I have seen it again and again after organisers have had all the hard work to get things organised.
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Unread 3 November 17, 20:09   #192
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Back on topic, I'd still would love to give the Group C cars a try at certain tracks, as inaccurate as most are, in this game. On my PS4.
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Unread 3 November 17, 23:57   #193
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Not sure if it has been fixed / patched but the PS4 version had a lot more issues than the PC version!
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Unread 4 November 17, 16:51   #194
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Come on, Durge, you know it doesn't work like that. Leagues are difficult, you need to find good members - or even just race active members - who can drive and keep series alive. 80% of people I've seen online, from leagues to public, aren't good drivers and maybe a third to half of those are overestimating their abilities.
You need to find the right league. I have raced in the same league for about 10 years and it just keeps growing. A bunch of great guys that enjoy racing and shooting the shit with each other. We actually get together a couple times a year and the Indy 500 and the Rolex, and some others. I expect about 8-10 guys at the Rolex.

The league is very good, top to bottom, with respect to quality racers. All are not the fastest but we try to race everyone respectfully.

And we broadcast the races live, so that adds to the whole atmosphere.

I have been on public servers probably 3-4 times in the last 5 years, just for the heck of it when I am bored. No other reason.
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Unread 6 November 17, 16:28   #195
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I'm not an alien but I pick up cars very quickly and if I have had practice, I'll be fighting at the front (in Reiza's stuff, ISI's stuff, and Papyrus stuff) for wins, and have beaten aliens and extreme devouts in championships. I don't expect that kind of level through a grid but there is another factor, the cars and tracks used, and in my case another picky factor being that I rarely enjoy driving slower cars like GTEs or GT3s, or open wheelers at GP3 or lesser level.

I've listed the two main leagues in rF2 but there are a few more that work well such as FWD cars or coupes. The main thing of your league is people understanding racing, lines, and behavior. That makes 75% of it already. The final 25% are the competitiveness on track.
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Unread 6 November 17, 18:20   #196
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Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by dartguy View Post
You need to find the right league. I have raced in the same league for about 10 years and it just keeps growing. A bunch of great guys that enjoy racing and shooting the shit with each other. We actually get together a couple times a year and the Indy 500 and the Rolex, and some others. I expect about 8-10 guys at the Rolex.

The league is very good, top to bottom, with respect to quality racers. All are not the fastest but we try to race everyone respectfully.

And we broadcast the races live, so that adds to the whole atmosphere.

I have been on public servers probably 3-4 times in the last 5 years, just for the heck of it when I am bored. No other reason.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guimengo View Post
I'm not an alien but I pick up cars very quickly and if I have had practice, I'll be fighting at the front (in Reiza's stuff, ISI's stuff, and Papyrus stuff) for wins, and have beaten aliens and extreme devouts in championships. I don't expect that kind of level through a grid but there is another factor, the cars and tracks used, and in my case another picky factor being that I rarely enjoy driving slower cars like GTEs or GT3s, or open wheelers at GP3 or lesser level.

I've listed the two main leagues in rF2 but there are a few more that work well such as FWD cars or coupes. The main thing of your league is people understanding racing, lines, and behavior. That makes 75% of it already. The final 25% are the competitiveness on track.
Bit of an off-topic but good theme to see discussed.

Maybe you (Guimengo) became just too serious and competitive (as simdriver, no idea as a person). That makes one set too high standards and be too picky, which usually creates a barrier, a distance.
I have to agree with dartguy there. IMO, it's very important what you race on, but even more important is the people you race with.

For instances, as much as I like the all involving aura and nastiness of GTP/PTC cars or fast OW'ers, they're awful for fun close racing with considerable grid sizes online.
Personally, I've ended prefering slower, lower tech and lighweight tin-top cars, as it's the proven best formula for those looking for fun, and not the ultimate laptime or place in the race. Even if not so alluring at first glance, they're more accessible and fun to more people.
Can remember people laughing about "the puny s**tboxes" (low tier Gr2 cars) in the beggining of GTL (and later in P&G) but, at some point, there weren't enough servers to fit so many people, always coming back for more.
IMO, and odd as that is, with a good balanced grid of clean drivers you can trust in a league, I really think that's the ultimate experience in online racing (very tight, close racing from start to finish).
.

Last edited by DucFreak; 6 November 17 at 19:09. Reason: spelling(?)
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Unread 6 November 17, 18:48   #197
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My choice of cars is absolutely not something suited for widespread competitive use, or easy to find widespread competitive use. Maybe a league of 10-15 guys would be possible but life and interests change with age, so unless that group is at least on late 30's and older, it is unlikely for a small, high level league to sustain itself.

I am not that serious or competitive in that sense. I am competitive as in I wish to do better and make notes of what I can improve but the most I practiced for anything was the CART league, and that was because I was enjoying the cars and creating a schedule plus car guides for everyone. That still averaged about 6 hours a week, no more. I don't have fun practicing by myself and AI is OK. That league was fun despite the breadth of talent and racecraft, it was the most successful one of that site actually.

I actually obtained enjoyment from pushing myself during the race and knowing the grid had a good number of guys who were enjoying their own fights for position. Most other leagues I didn't put much practice at all outside of race practice/qualifying sessions. With the slower cars, yes they are easier and thus accessible, but the gaps in a way do remain reasonable to the front runners (adjusting for car speed), it's just the slower guys making less big mistakes. The difficulty I have is keeping myself entertained when driving, especially if it's not a silly fun race where there's banter over TeamSpeak. But even then, so many guys can't drive while chatting or even listening to others, so that becomes an impossibility too.
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